ConwayLife.com

Here is a collaborative project of simulating processes in the human body with CA.
It will consist of several parts:
-Finding the right CA
-Creating individual processes and organs
-Fusing them into a functional structure
I doubt a lot that we will be able to flock everything into a LifeViewer window,but someone should definitely combine everything in Golly and make a photo.
The final structure must look like a human body and must be able to do the processes as realistically as possible.
Finding a way to make the creature breathe will be hard,but even harder will be the realistic brain,that would be God knows how big if ever created. As far as I know nobody have made anything any similar so far.
We are probably going to need to make a very specialized rule that will contain food and oxygen for the being and possibly also different cell types.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

Breathe? Is the universe supposed to be filled with a sparse agar called "air" that human body can live in?

Hunting wrote: October 27th, 2020, 3:55 am Breathe? Is the universe supposed to be filled with a sparse agar called "air" that human body can live in?

To breathe,to be realistic.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

BokaBB wrote: October 27th, 2020, 3:57 am

Hunting wrote: October 27th, 2020, 3:55 am Breathe? Is the universe supposed to be filled with a sparse agar called "air" that human body can live in?

To breathe,to be realistic.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

I'm not being sarcastic.

The main obstacle is, in reality, the human body doesn't collapse if a proton is placed in the wrong place. Two solutions:

1. The human body must be sparse enough and its parts must be independent enough.
2. Protection zone.

Hunting wrote: October 27th, 2020, 4:01 am

BokaBB wrote: October 27th, 2020, 3:57 am

Hunting wrote: October 27th, 2020, 3:55 am Breathe? Is the universe supposed to be filled with a sparse agar called "air" that human body can live in?

To breathe,to be realistic.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

I'm not being sarcastic.

The main obstacle is, in reality, the human body doesn't collapse if a proton is placed in the wrong place. Two solutions:

1. The human body must be sparse enough and its parts must be independent enough.
2. Protection zone.

Interesting debate,I am rather for the second one. What about making a rule in that making a wrong dot won't kill it and instead it is born and dies some other,more complex way?
Please visit my private message.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

BokaBB wrote: October 27th, 2020, 4:05 am

Hunting wrote: October 27th, 2020, 4:01 am

BokaBB wrote: October 27th, 2020, 3:57 am
To breathe,to be realistic.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

I'm not being sarcastic.

The main obstacle is, in reality, the human body doesn't collapse if a proton is placed in the wrong place. Two solutions:

1. The human body must be sparse enough and its parts must be independent enough.
2. Protection zone.

Interesting debate,I am rather for the second one. What about making a rule in that making a wrong dot won't kill it and instead it is born and dies some other,more complex way?
Please visit my private message.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

It'll be better if we do both. And I agree on the make rule part.

The basis of human body is chemical reactions. (You can create your own basis, but that's too much work and not realistic.)

Hunting wrote: October 27th, 2020, 4:43 am The basis of human body is chemical reactions. (You can create your own basis, but that's too much work and not realistic.)

We can make it to some degree,but the cellular degree will be too hard and everything would be big.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

BokaBB wrote: October 27th, 2020, 4:44 am

Hunting wrote: October 27th, 2020, 4:43 am The basis of human body is chemical reactions. (You can create your own basis, but that's too much work and not realistic.)

We can make it to some degree,but the cellular degree will be too hard and everything would be big.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

Nothing is impossible. Golly Rule Tables are all 2D CAs, but who cares.

We also need cell states to represent energy.

Hunting wrote: October 27th, 2020, 4:51 am

BokaBB wrote: October 27th, 2020, 4:44 am

Hunting wrote: October 27th, 2020, 4:43 am The basis of human body is chemical reactions. (You can create your own basis, but that's too much work and not realistic.)

We can make it to some degree,but the cellular degree will be too hard and everything would be big.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

Nothing is impossible. Golly Rule Tables are all 2D CAs, but who cares.

We also need cell states to represent energy.

Energy is also important,altrough we could just make that everything dissipates slowly unless some food is eaten, water is drunk and oxygen is used.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

BokaBB wrote: October 27th, 2020, 4:55 am

Hunting wrote: October 27th, 2020, 4:51 am

BokaBB wrote: October 27th, 2020, 4:44 am
We can make it to some degree,but the cellular degree will be too hard and everything would be big.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

Nothing is impossible. Golly Rule Tables are all 2D CAs, but who cares.

We also need cell states to represent energy.

Energy is also important,altrough we could just make that everything dissipates slowly unless some food is eaten, water is drunk and oxygen is used.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

We're not yet at that stage! And it's you who said it should realistic, and I doubt "dissipates slowly" when starving is realistic...

Hunting wrote: October 27th, 2020, 5:00 am

BokaBB wrote: October 27th, 2020, 4:55 am

Hunting wrote: October 27th, 2020, 4:51 am

Nothing is impossible. Golly Rule Tables are all 2D CAs, but who cares.

We also need cell states to represent energy.

Energy is also important,altrough we could just make that everything dissipates slowly unless some food is eaten, water is drunk and oxygen is used.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

We're not yet at that stage! And it's you who said it should realistic, and I doubt "dissipates slowly" when starving is realistic...

I know,but not all organs,just muscles,maybe bones and so. Concentration is lost and similar. Over time they intensify until the human dies.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

BokaBB wrote: October 27th, 2020, 5:02 am

Hunting wrote: October 27th, 2020, 5:00 am

BokaBB wrote: October 27th, 2020, 4:55 am
Energy is also important,altrough we could just make that everything dissipates slowly unless some food is eaten, water is drunk and oxygen is used.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

We're not yet at that stage! And it's you who said it should realistic, and I doubt "dissipates slowly" when starving is realistic...

I know,but not all organs,just muscles,maybe bones and so. Concentration is lost and similar. Over time they intensify until the human dies.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

I said! We're not yet at that stage!

Will a cell (as in cellular automata) represent a basic particle in real life, or will it be an atom?

Hunting wrote: October 27th, 2020, 5:00 am We're not yet at that stage! And it's you who said it should realistic, and I doubt "dissipates slowly" when starving is realistic...

I was thinking of making a thread on CA biology actually. I think we should start simple. A while ago I was think of a molecular CA: There would be different types of "atoms" with different properties. Some would love to bond, some would be inert, some in between. The rule would be designed in a way to allow complex structures like polymers. There would also be "energy": atoms will have energy and release it directly to adjacent atoms and through empty space by radiation. We could also have some sort of infinite energy source to fuel reactions, because energy would radiate into empty space. Reactions between atoms would release or capture energy, basically exothermic and endothermic. When atoms come into contact, heat flows from hot to cold.

Hunting wrote: October 27th, 2020, 5:13 am

BokaBB wrote: October 27th, 2020, 5:02 am

Hunting wrote: October 27th, 2020, 5:00 am

We're not yet at that stage! And it's you who said it should realistic, and I doubt "dissipates slowly" when starving is realistic...

I know,but not all organs,just muscles,maybe bones and so. Concentration is lost and similar. Over time they intensify until the human dies.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

I said! We're not yet at that stage!

Will a cell (as in cellular automata) represent a basic particle in real life, or will it be an atom?

Not an atom,probably a part of the tissue,not all,but larger than a cell. That is my opinion.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

Schiaparelliorbust wrote: October 27th, 2020, 5:15 am

Hunting wrote: October 27th, 2020, 5:00 am We're not yet at that stage! And it's you who said it should realistic, and I doubt "dissipates slowly" when starving is realistic...

I was thinking of making a thread on CA biology actually. I think we should start simple. A while ago I was think of a molecular CA: There would be different types of "atoms" with different properties. Some would love to bond, some would be inert, some in between. The rule would be designed in a way to allow complex structures like polymers. There would also be "energy": atoms will have energy and release it directly to adjacent atoms and through empty space by radiation. We could also have some sort of infinite energy source to fuel reactions, because energy would radiate into empty space. Reactions between atoms would release or capture energy, basically exothermic and endothermic. When atoms come into contact, heat flows from hot to cold.

So you are planning to implement a hypothetical world with a brand new chemistry system?

BokaBB wrote: October 27th, 2020, 5:18 am

Hunting wrote: October 27th, 2020, 5:13 am

BokaBB wrote: October 27th, 2020, 5:02 am
I know,but not all organs,just muscles,maybe bones and so. Concentration is lost and similar. Over time they intensify until the human dies.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

I said! We're not yet at that stage!

Will a cell (as in cellular automata) represent a basic particle in real life, or will it be an atom?

Not an atom,probably a part of the tissue,not all,but larger than a cell. That is my opinion.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

That's totally impratical. A real life cell have many functions and states (much more than 256), and it's impossible to simulate it with a CA cell.

Hunting wrote: October 27th, 2020, 5:18 am

Schiaparelliorbust wrote: October 27th, 2020, 5:15 am

Hunting wrote: October 27th, 2020, 5:00 am We're not yet at that stage! And it's you who said it should realistic, and I doubt "dissipates slowly" when starving is realistic...

I was thinking of making a thread on CA biology actually. I think we should start simple. A while ago I was think of a molecular CA: There would be different types of "atoms" with different properties. Some would love to bond, some would be inert, some in between. The rule would be designed in a way to allow complex structures like polymers. There would also be "energy": atoms will have energy and release it directly to adjacent atoms and through empty space by radiation. We could also have some sort of infinite energy source to fuel reactions, because energy would radiate into empty space. Reactions between atoms would release or capture energy, basically exothermic and endothermic. When atoms come into contact, heat flows from hot to cold.

So you are planning to implement a hypothetical world with a brand new chemistry system?

Yes, that's exactly what I'm thinking of. Biology is just self sustaining chemistry, so if we make something like this, simple "bacteria" with membranes that can "eat" and digest "food" for energy might be possible to make.

Schiaparelliorbust wrote: October 27th, 2020, 5:21 am

Hunting wrote: October 27th, 2020, 5:18 am

Schiaparelliorbust wrote: October 27th, 2020, 5:15 am
I was thinking of making a thread on CA biology actually. I think we should start simple. A while ago I was think of a molecular CA: There would be different types of "atoms" with different properties. Some would love to bond, some would be inert, some in between. The rule would be designed in a way to allow complex structures like polymers. There would also be "energy": atoms will have energy and release it directly to adjacent atoms and through empty space by radiation. We could also have some sort of infinite energy source to fuel reactions, because energy would radiate into empty space. Reactions between atoms would release or capture energy, basically exothermic and endothermic. When atoms come into contact, heat flows from hot to cold.

So you are planning to implement a hypothetical world with a brand new chemistry system?

Yes, that's exactly what I'm thinking of. Biology is just self sustaining chemistry, so if we make something like this, simple "bacteria" with membranes that can "eat" and digest "food" for energy might be possible to make.

Cell states representing "bonds" would be good.

Hunting wrote: October 27th, 2020, 5:19 am

BokaBB wrote: October 27th, 2020, 5:18 am

Hunting wrote: October 27th, 2020, 5:13 am
I said! We're not yet at that stage!

Will a cell (as in cellular automata) represent a basic particle in real life, or will it be an atom?

Not an atom,probably a part of the tissue,not all,but larger than a cell. That is my opinion.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

That's totally impratical. A real life cell have many functions and states (much more than 256), and it's impossible to simulate it with a CA cell.

I said it is impractical to have too tiny particles to operate with. A part of the tissue is the representable thing on my vote. The cells from the same tissue will react the same way.
The cells may react a certain way in contact with the other cells.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

Hunting wrote: October 27th, 2020, 5:22 am Cell states representing "bonds" would be good.

Not cells representing bonds but different states representing bonded and unbonded atoms would be better I think.

BokaBB wrote: October 27th, 2020, 5:23 am

Hunting wrote: October 27th, 2020, 5:19 am

BokaBB wrote: October 27th, 2020, 5:18 am
Not an atom,probably a part of the tissue,not all,but larger than a cell. That is my opinion.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

That's totally impratical. A real life cell have many functions and states (much more than 256), and it's impossible to simulate it with a CA cell.

I said it is impractical to have too tiny particles to operate with. A part of the tissue is the representable thing on my vote. The cells from the same tissue will react the same way.
The cells may react a certain way in contact with the other cells.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

... @Sch, explain to him.

Schiaparelliorbust wrote: October 27th, 2020, 5:25 am

Hunting wrote: October 27th, 2020, 5:22 am Cell states representing "bonds" would be good.

Not cells representing bonds but different states representing bonded and unbonded atoms would be better I think.

Oh, that make sense. But then it would be better to have different states for different "bonding capacity left".

Hunting wrote: October 27th, 2020, 5:28 am

BokaBB wrote: October 27th, 2020, 5:23 am

Hunting wrote: October 27th, 2020, 5:19 am

That's totally impratical. A real life cell have many functions and states (much more than 256), and it's impossible to simulate it with a CA cell.

I said it is impractical to have too tiny particles to operate with. A part of the tissue is the representable thing on my vote. The cells from the same tissue will react the same way.
The cells may react a certain way in contact with the other cells.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

... @Sch, explain to him.

What?
I know it is easier to first make proto - life,but we will never finish our project if we have too tiny particles to work with. Nothing else.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

Hunting wrote: October 27th, 2020, 5:28 am ... @Sch, explain to him.

Explain my idea?

BokaBB wrote: October 27th, 2020, 4:44 am We can make it to some degree,but the cellular degree will be too hard and everything would be big.
Have a good day!

BokaBB

This is quite an ambitious project. We should start way smaller. Please look at my chemistry CA proposal.