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Re: Catagolue Oddities
Posted: December 19th, 2017, 1:15 am
by Majestas32
I mean generations rules are bad, but this is by far the most egregious example of a pseudo still life I've seen on catagolue.
https://catagolue.appspot.com/object/xs ... g3b348s238
Yes, this has 6 occurrences. And yes, there are similar "xs" 36, 40, and 66 with 2 occurrences each. (I blame the p444 21c/74 puffer honestly).
EDIT: Also some of the "xs" 8, 12, and 16 are just random CONSTELLATIONS of blocks not even pseudo still lives. There's not even xs8_rr! WTF
Re: Catagolue Oddities
Posted: December 19th, 2017, 1:56 am
by Apple Bottom
Could you please not use URL shorteners?
Re: Catagolue Oddities
Posted: December 19th, 2017, 2:36 am
by Majestas32
Apple Bottom wrote:
Could you please not use URL shorteners?
Fixed (but why, may I ask?)
Re: Catagolue Oddities
Posted: December 19th, 2017, 2:44 am
by Apple Bottom
Majestas32 wrote:Fixed (but why, may I ask?)
It's just nicer to be able to see what object's being talked about right away. If the board software is sufficiently smart it'll also index the object's code and make it findable (less important in this particular case, maybe...!)
Re: Catagolue Oddities
Posted: December 19th, 2017, 3:03 am
by Majestas32
*subtle nod to try to get you to apgsearch this rule*
Re: Catagolue Oddities
Posted: December 19th, 2017, 5:46 am
by mniemiec
Majestas32 wrote:Fixed (but why, may I ask?)
Apple Bottom wrote:It's just nicer to be able to see what object's being talked about right away. If the board software is sufficiently smart it'll also index the object's code and make it findable (less important in this particular case, maybe...!)
It should still be fairly easy - navigating to the URL shortener will redirect to the actual Catagolue page; the apgode could then be easily copied from browser URL bar.
This "object" seems like a spectacular fail in the constellation separation algorithm. I'm curious if this was found with a hacked version of apgsearch?
Re: Catagolue Oddities
Posted: December 19th, 2017, 7:34 am
by Apple Bottom
Majestas32 wrote:*subtle nod to try to get you to apgsearch this rule*
No subtle nods needed, just asking nicely is (usually) enough to get me to help.
Re: Catagolue Oddities
Posted: December 19th, 2017, 12:28 pm
by Majestas32
mniemiec wrote:Majestas32 wrote:Fixed (but why, may I ask?)
Apple Bottom wrote:It's just nicer to be able to see what object's being talked about right away. If the board software is sufficiently smart it'll also index the object's code and make it findable (less important in this particular case, maybe...!)
It should still be fairly easy - navigating to the URL shortener will redirect to the actual Catagolue page; the apgode could then be easily copied from browser URL bar.
This "object" seems like a spectacular fail in the constellation separation algorithm. I'm curious if this was found with a hacked version of apgsearch?
Nope, just the current version of apgluxe 4.2
And currently there are fake xs8, xs12, xs16, xs18, xs20, xs24, xs28, xs30, xs36, xs40, xs50, xs54, xs62, and xs66 -- all but the xs8 have even numbers of occurrences and the xs62 has occurred 18 times so it's not just a one-off.
There are also ov_s72, ov_s76, ov_s92, ov_s204, and ov_s212 with all but the s204 with even numbers of occurrences and the s72 and s76 have each occurred 40 times.
Re: Catagolue Oddities
Posted: December 19th, 2017, 12:43 pm
by apg
I haven't yet implemented oscillator separation for multi-state rules, which is why constellations can be censused whenever there's a messy puffer in a Generations rule.
Re: Catagolue Oddities
Posted: December 19th, 2017, 2:28 pm
by mniemiec
calcyman wrote:I haven't yet implemented oscillator separation for multi-state rules, which is why constellations can be censused whenever there's a messy puffer in a Generations rule.
Once you have the constellation as a single "object", why not then run another separation on that all by itself? The one mentioned above is "obviously" (with a sufficiently heuristic definition of "obvious") made up of smaller pieces. In any event, if anything has aleady been determined to be a still-life, survival rules should be irrelevant. Birth rules are only relevant for things like not splitting an aircraft carrier into two separate trominos.
Re: Catagolue Oddities
Posted: December 19th, 2017, 2:33 pm
by Majestas32
I mean this is probably the first yl apgsearched in a generations rule so...
Re: Catagolue Oddities
Posted: December 19th, 2017, 3:21 pm
by apg
mniemiec wrote:calcyman wrote:I haven't yet implemented oscillator separation for multi-state rules, which is why constellations can be censused whenever there's a messy puffer in a Generations rule.
Once you have the constellation as a single "object", why not then run another separation on that all by itself?
Great idea! I've now opted for the simplest approach of recursively calling 'census' (with a maximum depth of 1) whenever advanced object separation is unavailable. That should correctly handle dying debris in B0/Generations rules:
https://gitlab.com/apgoucher/apgmera
Re: Catagolue Oddities
Posted: December 20th, 2017, 2:12 pm
by Apple Bottom
Majestas32 wrote:I mean this is probably the first yl apgsearched in a generations rule so...
Hardly:
Code: Select all
sqlite> select rule, count(distinct code) as cnt from census where type="yl" and generations="1" group by rule order by cnt desc;
g4b34s23 91
g10b34578s2378 79
g8b3s345 67
g10b345s345 35
g9b3468s235678 24
g8b37s345 13
g4b35s23567 12
g4b34678s24568 10
g5b3s23 6
g20b3s23 4
g4b34578s2378 4
g7b3s23 4
g10b2s0345 3
g4b3678s235678 3
g6b3s23 3
g8b3s23 3
g9b3s23 3
g18b3s23 2
g19b3s23 2
g3b345s23 2
g8b34s23 2
g10b3s23 1
g3b3578s2378 1
g3b36s125 1
g4b3s23 1
g5b26s345 1
g5b35678s23 1
g5b37s23 1
g6b35678s23 1
g7b2s0 1
Re: Catagolue Oddities
Posted: December 22nd, 2017, 6:41 pm
by lifeisawesome
Re: Catagolue Oddities
Posted: January 2nd, 2018, 1:22 am
by Saka
Catagolue has
user pages for nonexistent users.
Which can also be turned into things like
this
Re: Catagolue Oddities
Posted: January 4th, 2018, 9:27 am
by tophattingson
Catagolue seems to have difficulty separating spaceships from other spaceships in Isotropic non-totalistic Life-like rules. I suspect it's because the lagging spaceship enters the bounding box of the main spaceship during a complete period?
https://catagolue.appspot.com/object/xq ... /b3-n4ns23
Re: Catagolue Oddities
Posted: January 4th, 2018, 9:37 am
by muzik
That's a really well known issue.
Re: Catagolue Oddities
Posted: January 4th, 2018, 1:16 pm
by mniemiec
tophattingson wrote:Catagolue seems to have difficulty separating spaceships from other spaceships in Isotropic non-totalistic Life-like rules. I suspect it's because the lagging spaceship enters the bounding box of the main spaceship during a complete period?
This is also a problem with the Life rule itself.
Re: Catagolue Oddities
Posted: January 13th, 2018, 9:02 am
by Saka
Another "Magic Pattern" incident,
At
the page for this xq264, the only listed soup:
Code: Select all
x = 32, y = 31, rule = B2n3aijr4i5ceky6ci/S2-n3-ac4cinty5-aery6-ck7e
bbooooobobboboboobobobbobooooobb$
oooobbbobobbooobbooobbobobbboooo$
oobobobboboboobooboobobobboboboo$
oobobobbobbbbboooobbbbbobboboboo$
bobobbboooooooooooooooooobbbobob$
obbobobboooobooooooboooobbobobbo$
obbbbbbbobooooobbooooobobbbbbbbo$
oobboobbboobobboobboboobbboobboo$
ooobooboooobboobboobbooooboobooo$
oobooobboobbbbboobbbbboobboooboo$
obbooooobbobbboooobbbobbooooobbo$
oooboobobbboboboobobobbboboobooo$
bboboboobbooboobbooboobboobobobb$
obobobobboobboboobobboobbobobobo$
bobobbboobbboooooooobbboobbbobob$
obboobooobooooboobooooboooboobbo$
bobobbboobbboooooooobbboobbbobob$
obobobobboobboboobobboobbobobobo$
bboboboobbooboobbooboobboobobobb$
oooboobobbboboboobobobbboboobooo$
obbooooobbobbboooobbbobbooooobbo$
oobooobboobbbbboobbbbboobboooboo$
ooobooboooobboobboobbooooboobooo$
oobboobbboobobboobboboobbboobboo$
obbbbbbbobooooobbooooobobbbbbbbo$
obbobobboooobooooooboooobbobobbo$
bobobbboooooooooooooooooobbbobob$
oobobobbobbbbboooobbbbbobboboboo$
oobobobboboboobooboobobobboboboo$
oooobbbobobbooobbooobbobobbboooo$
bbooooobobboboboobobobbobooooobb!
does not actually produce the pattern but the pattern is an actual valid ship:
Code: Select all
x = 68, y = 10, rule = B2n3aijr4i5ceky6ci/S2-n3-ac4cinty5-aery6-ck7e
3o62b3o$obo62bobo$o2bo3b2o3b3o38b3o3b2o3bo2bo$b4obobo3bobo38bobo3bobob
4o$5bo2bo3b2o40b2o3bo2bo3$21bo6b2o8b2o6bo$20bobo5b2o8b2o5bobo$21bo6b2o
8b2o6bo!
EDIT:
And for
xq604_cksxs48g8cb97zylgy6fzyl3zzyfqie too
Re: Catagolue Oddities
Posted: January 14th, 2018, 7:50 am
by Saka
Re: Catagolue Oddities
Posted: January 17th, 2018, 6:47 am
by Rhombic
I submitted a ~6500000 soup haul to B3/S23, it did get to "uncommitted hauls" yet then disappeared and it has not been committed. Has it ben rejected? If so, why?!
EDIT: It has now been committed. However, for about 3-5 minutes the haul was nowhere to be seen!
Re: Catagolue Oddities
Posted: January 17th, 2018, 7:24 am
by Saka
Rhombic wrote:...However, for about 3-5 minutes the haul was nowhere to be seen!
That happens to me as well and I also dont know why and can be worrying, but I've learned to be patient.
Re: Catagolue Oddities
Posted: January 17th, 2018, 5:22 pm
by dani
Re: Catagolue Oddities
Posted: January 17th, 2018, 11:02 pm
by mniemiec
Only half of the objects listed here are correct:
xp6_37eso: the first and last soups totally die, not producing the object. Some others do.
xp6_w5evelz23: correct.
xp6_0ggkkllllkkggzaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa88z1155llllllllllll55zy222aaaa22: apgcode is not even valid.
xp6_0kkllkkz0giiiigz9bbaabb9z11555511: correct.
xp6_6gfzw60f: the only soup makes only a P2.
xp6_fg6zs0v0u0oz1070f03: the only soup makes only two P2s and a glider.
xp6_mkllllkmz0nggggnz22aaaa22: correct.
xp6_y0gw5alakzo0u0v0fz30701: correct.
Re: Catagolue Oddities
Posted: January 20th, 2018, 1:33 pm
by dani
Yet another 'weird looking oscillator', this time p8 and quite different.
Here is the link to the page containing said 'weird looking oscillator'.
It's the 1375th object in
the haul, and
the soup is quite boring, as it only gives a couple standard still lifes and oscillators:
Code: Select all
x = 31, y = 31, rule = B2e3ain4-cjqtw5ceiry6-ac78/S2ac3ajknq4eiqwy5-ain6-e78
booooooboboboobobooboboboooooob$
ooooooooboooooobooooooboooooooo$
oobbbbooooooooboboooooooobbbboo$
ooboooooobooooboboooobooooooboo$
oobooobobbbbbbbbbbbbbbboboooboo$
ooboooobbbbbbobobobbbbbbooooboo$
oooobobbbooboooboooboobbboboooo$
boooobbbbbooboooooboobbbbboooob$
oboobbbbbbbbbbbobbbbbbbbbbboobo$
boobbbobbobbbbbobbbbbobbobbboob$
oooobboobbbobobbbobobbboobboooo$
booobbbobbooooobooooobbobbbooob$
oooobbobbbbooooboooobbbbobboooo$
oooobooobbooobbbbbooobboooboooo$
bobbbboobbboobbobboobbboobbbbob$
oboobobooobbbbooobbbboooboboobo$
bobbbboobbboobbobboobbboobbbbob$
oooobooobbooobbbbbooobboooboooo$
oooobbobbbbooooboooobbbbobboooo$
booobbbobbooooobooooobbobbbooob$
oooobboobbbobobbbobobbboobboooo$
boobbbobbobbbbbobbbbbobbobbboob$
oboobbbbbbbbbbbobbbbbbbbbbboobo$
boooobbbbbooboooooboobbbbboooob$
oooobobbbooboooboooboobbboboooo$
ooboooobbbbbbobobobbbbbbooooboo$
oobooobobbbbbbbbbbbbbbboboooboo$
ooboooooobooooboboooobooooooboo$
oobbbbooooooooboboooooooobbbboo$
ooooooooboooooobooooooboooooooo$
booooooboboboobobooboboboooooob!
The pattern itself doesn't even do anything of note!:
Code: Select all
x = 25, y = 25, rule = B2e3ain4-cjqtw5ceiry6-ac78/S2ac3ajknq4eiqwy5-ain6-e78
7b4o2$5b8o2$3b12o2$b16o$o$b18o2$2b19o2$b22o2$2b23o2$4b20o2$6b16o2$8b
12o2$10b8o2$12b4o!