Non-notable Pages

[Apersoma]

I propose an idea to put pattern pages that are removed from the wiki for not being notable into a larger page for patterns like that. I have already created an example of what this page could look like for this purpose.https://conwaylife.com/wiki/Non-notable_Oscillators This is also a good compromise for when someone keeps creating a page that then gets deleted. There are exceptions though. If a pattern isn't notable becuase it is too similar to another patter then it still doesn't get put on the page becuase is would belong on the page of pattern it is similar to even if the origin pattern is on a non-notable page becuase then that original pattern is probaly notable enough for its own page. This also good for engineered patterns that aren't notable becuase they don't really have many places right now.

TLDR: Should a pages that contain a lot of non-notable patterns be created.

[muzik]

Isn't this exactly what existing list pages are there for?

[confocaloid]

I propose an idea to put pattern pages that are removed from the wiki for not being notable into a larger page for patterns like that. I have already created an example of what this page could look like for this purpose.https://conwaylife.com/wiki/Non-notable_Oscillators

One existing alternative is to put such pages into your userspace. For example, the linked page Non-notable Oscillators could probably be moved into your userspace, to become something like User:Apersoma/Non-notable Oscillators instead.

I think the main namespace is best reserved for actual pages about things that are notable (in the sense of LifeWiki:Notability).

[iddi01]

Proposal: make an article called Non-notable OCA, which (semi-)automatically lists all all subpages (like Non-notable OCA/Example rule). There are no notability requirements to create an OCA page as a subpage of it, though the subpages are still required to look like a regular OCA page.
When multiple people thinks a subpage is notable enough, it can be moved to the main namespace.

Add a link to the page in the "see also" in OCA, List of Life-like rules, List of isotropic non-totalistic rules, List of strobing rules, Tutorials/Finding rules, and other relevant articles i missed.

The reason for this:

- To cause more OCA articles to be created. Right now there are way too few articles about INT rules, which might be an important reason for commonplace behavior of newcomers posting non-notable rules as threads. (For reference, when i discovered B0123456/S5, the behavior is unlike anything documented on LifeWiki, so i thought it was "the most interesting rule ever" and posted a thread for it, but it's actually explosive and mediocre until i made an INT modification, even then it isn't nearly as good as my later tflock 2)

- To allow pages for non-notable rules to be released to the public. As far as i know, few people often read user pages, and even fewer edit them when the owner allow or even want them to do that. There are many user pages about various rules, and some look very mature and notable, but got way less attention than they deserve.

[confocaloid]

Related discussion: viewtopic.php?f=16&t=5934

Proposal: make an article called Non-notable OCA, which (semi-)automatically lists all all subpages (like Non-notable OCA/Example rule). There are no notability requirements to create an OCA page as a subpage of it, though the subpages are still required to look like a regular OCA page.
When multiple people thinks a subpage is notable enough, it can be moved to the main namespace.
[...]

That would still be in the main namespace (as anything that doesn't specify a MediaWiki namespace). So the style/notability/quality requirements and guidelines would apply to that, too.

I think the "User:" namespace suffices for draft pages. If they want to do so, the initial contributor(s) can add a note at the top of an user-namespace page, giving an explicit permission for others to edit the draft.

In addition, any notable topic about CA other than Conway's Life would go to the "OCA:" namespace, rather than the main namespace.

[confocaloid]

crossposting related discussion

Proposal: make an article called Non-notable OCA, which (semi-)automatically lists all all subpages (like Non-notable OCA/Example rule). There are no notability requirements to create an OCA page as a subpage of it, though the subpages are still required to look like a regular OCA page.
When multiple people thinks a subpage is notable enough, it can be moved to the main namespace.

Add a link to the page in the "see also" in OCA, List of Life-like rules, List of isotropic non-totalistic rules, List of strobing rules, Tutorials/Finding rules, and other relevant articles i missed.

The reason for this:

- To cause more OCA articles to be created. Right now there are way too few articles about INT rules, which might be an important reason for commonplace behavior of newcomers posting non-notable rules as threads. (For reference, when i discovered B0123456/S5, the behavior is unlike anything documented on LifeWiki, so i thought it was "the most interesting rule ever" and posted a thread for it, but it's actually explosive and mediocre until i made an INT modification, even then it isn't nearly as good as my later tflock 2)

- To allow pages for non-notable rules to be released to the public. As far as i know, few people often read user pages, and even fewer edit them when the owner allow or even want them to do that. There are many user pages about various rules, and some look very mature and notable, but got way less attention than they deserve.

Related discussion: viewtopic.php?f=16&t=5934

Proposal: make an article called Non-notable OCA, which (semi-)automatically lists all all subpages (like Non-notable OCA/Example rule). There are no notability requirements to create an OCA page as a subpage of it, though the subpages are still required to look like a regular OCA page.
When multiple people thinks a subpage is notable enough, it can be moved to the main namespace.
[...]

That would still be in the main namespace (as anything that doesn't specify a MediaWiki namespace). So the style/notability/quality requirements and guidelines would apply to that, too.

I think the "User:" namespace suffices for draft pages. If they want to do so, the initial contributor(s) can add a note at the top of an user-namespace page, giving an explicit permission for others to edit the draft.

In addition, any notable topic about CA other than Conway's Life would go to the "OCA:" namespace, rather than the main namespace.

[iddi01]

That would still be in the main namespace (as anything that doesn't specify a MediaWiki namespace). So the style/notability/quality requirements and guidelines would apply to that, too.

I think the "User:" namespace suffices for draft pages. If they want to do so, the initial contributor(s) can add a note at the top of an user-namespace page, giving an explicit permission for others to edit the draft.

In addition, any notable topic about CA other than Conway's Life would go to the "OCA:" namespace, rather than the main namespace.

1. Then the proposed name becomes Misc:Non-notable OCA, this way it will no longer be in the main namespace.

2. You don't get the problem, not every OCA user page is a draft. Some are user pages only for notability issues. In that situation, they want their articles to be viewed more, but being in the user namespace means the article is viewed as few times as it can get. How can someone edit a page they never visited?

3. By "main namespace", i mean all namespaces with the same requirements as the real main namespace.

[confocaloid]

1. Then the proposed name becomes Misc:Non-notable OCA, this way it will no longer be in the main namespace.

It will still be in the main namespace, since there's no namespace "Misc" on LifeWiki as far as I know.

I guess you could put it under "OCA:Non-notable OCA", which would put it in the "OCA:" namespace. But the other issues with the idea would remain unresolved.

2. You don't get the problem, not every OCA user page is a draft. Some are user pages only for notability issues. In that situation, they want their articles to be viewed more, but being in the user namespace means the article is viewed as few times as it can get. How can someone edit a page they never visited?

3. By "main namespace", i mean all namespaces with the same requirements as the real main namespace.

If a topic is not notable in the sense of LW:NB, why should it go to either the main namespace or the OCA: namespace, then?
The entire purpose of notability guidelines is to avoid cluttering main namespace(s) with non-notable topics.

I suggest to continue the discussion in viewtopic.php?f=16&t=5934 which was an earlier related suggestion, to avoid having multiple discussions interleaved in one thread.

[iddi01]

If a topic is not notable in the sense of LW:NB, why should it go to either the main namespace or the OCA: namespace, then?
The entire purpose of notability guidelines is to avoid cluttering main namespace(s) with non-notable topics.

I suggest to continue the discussion in viewtopic.php?f=16&t=5934 which was an earlier related suggestion, to avoid having multiple discussions interleaved in one thread.

The related discussion is short, and doesn't contain much information.

We could create a new namespace "Misc" for storing non-notable stuff and add at least some links to the namespace.

Or, any ideas on making user pages more visible? There are many good user pages that should not go unnoticed.

[confocaloid]

[...] The related discussion is short, and doesn't contain much information. [...]

My point is that it's related and it can serve as a good place to continue the discussion.

[...] We could create a new namespace "Misc" for storing non-notable stuff and add at least some links to the namespace. [...]

Actually, "we" couldn't; one would need to demonstrate some evidence that such a namespace is actually needed, and then perhaps ask the administrator to create it.

[...] Or, any ideas on making user pages more visible? There are many good user pages that should not go unnoticed.

I think lists of "non-notable stuff" shouldn't go to either the main namespace or the OCA: namespace. I don't think a "Misc" namespace would be a good idea, either, because it would cause the same problems that are supposed to be solved with quality/notability requirements, and many of the existing issues with Sandbox subforum activity.

Otherwise the next question may unexpectedly end up something like "Any ideas on making Sandbox threads more visible?"

I don't think user pages "in general" need to be much more visible than they already are. If you are discussing some specific topic on the forums, and if you want to make some specific user page more visible, then you can simply link to that user page from your post. Links work better when there is some context. A long list of "miscellaneous" links doesn't give that.

[dvgrn]

Or, any ideas on making user pages more visible? There are many good user pages that should not go unnoticed.

I've moved the discussion on non-notable OCA pages over here, and I do hope there's some further discussion about this. I'm sure there are lots of possible creative ideas for some workable method for getting more of the "good stuff" out of the obscurity of user pages and into the main OCA area -- while still leaving user pages as a good place for "research and development" for new OCA pages, while rules are in the process of evolving from non-notable to notable!

I've also created a separate LifeWiki discussion topic just now, on the very vaguely related topic of an OCA landing page and/or OCA CurrentNews list.

[confocaloid]

Two recent examples of pages about a non-notable topic are OCA:Juggernauts and Juggernauts.
Both are created by the same person (who is also the inventor of the name and the first person to investigate the CA).

Any such pages should be moved to userspace (and in this case likely history-merged), until and unless there's evidence of notability (LW:NB) as a separate topic.

[confocaloid]

Several LW:NB-problematic pages:

• OCA:Juggernauts, Juggernauts Non-notable CA, should be either moved to userspace or deleted.
• OCA:Blinker Life Non-notable name, probably should be moved to OCA:Virus.
• OCA:Rule 184, OCA:Rule 30, OCA:Rule 90 Essentially empty pages; as far as I know "external soft redirects" of this kind are not otherwise used in this wiki. Likely should be deleted, along with Category:Soft redirected pages.

[Haycat2009]

For context:

I call this rule juggernauts

Code: Select all

x = 665, y = 194, rule = B2ce3-cnry4-ajknz5eiqry/S1c2a3n4-w
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4bobo2bo$220bobob4obobo$222b3o2b3o$223bob2obo!