Pattern viewer for forum threads

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Re: Pattern viewer for forum threads

Post by rowett »

wirehead wrote: December 27th, 2022, 11:50 pm Also, suppose people want to customize the look and feel of LifeViewer to match the look and feel of the site it's embedded in.
Ah, a potential requirement! If there was a large demand for such a thing (beyond the colour customization that already exists) then it might be worth the investment of enhancing or re-writing the LifeView UI. Cost vs benefit.
wirehead wrote: December 27th, 2022, 11:50 pm At the very least, I'm willing to help with documentation.
Perhaps more useful, as a mentioned before, would be if you were interested in prototyping various features. For example one recent request was to output the symmetry of a still life, oscillator or space ship.
wirehead wrote: December 27th, 2022, 11:50 pm Sorry I didn't post this one sooner -- @ICON support.
This is already planned. The @ICONS section parser was written long ago. The renderer is on the backlog.
If you load a rule with an @ICONS section then you'll see info about the icons in Help->Info->Pattern.

Code: Select all

x = 1, y = 1, rule = Langtons-Ant
E!
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Re: Pattern viewer for forum threads

Post by wirehead »

rowett wrote: December 28th, 2022, 6:12 am Ah, a potential requirement! If there was a large demand for such a thing (beyond the colour customization that already exists) then it might be worth the investment of enhancing or re-writing the LifeView UI. Cost vs benefit.
And it would be at no cost to you. I would be the one re-writing the UI, I would be the one testing it to make sure I didn't break anything, and all you'd have to do is (a) grant me access to whatever repository you've put your code in so that I can fork it, and (b) merge the pull request if and when you approve of my changes, or (c) close the pull request if you don't approve of them. Reviewing code takes a lot less time and effort than actually writing, testing, and debugging it, and I'm sure you're a pretty busy person yourself.
rowett wrote: December 28th, 2022, 6:12 am Perhaps more useful, as a mentioned before, would be if you were interested in prototyping various features. For example one recent request was to output the symmetry of a still life, oscillator or space ship.
Thank you for that idea! I can see right now that such a demo/tool/whatever is going to need an RLE parser. Can LifeViewer be made, at the very least, source-available? Again, as I keep saying, I think it's better in the long run to use tried and tested chunks of code whenever possible (i.e. LifeViewer's RLE parser) instead of a quick-and-dirty (and possibly buggy) RLE parser I threw together in a few hours. Oh, and if it's going to be later integrated into LifeViewer, doesn't it make sense to utilize existing bits of LifeViewer to support the new addition? I'm sure when you wrote the code for the selection tool you did not hesitate to "borrow" code from the UI library to check if the mouse is over the selection rectangle in the same manner that the buttons check if the mouse is over them. You're not making any money out of keeping LifeViewer proprietary software that I know of, so what harm can come of letting people at least see your code, even if you're not accepting pull requests?
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Re: Pattern viewer for forum threads

Post by muzik »

rowett wrote: December 28th, 2022, 6:12 am Perhaps more useful, as a mentioned before, would be if you were interested in prototyping various features. For example one recent request was to output the symmetry of a still life, oscillator or space ship.
I'm not sure if this counts as a prototype per se, but Nakano (one of many Oscillizer revivals) can compute the symmetry of a provided oscillator: viewtopic.php?f=9&t=5341&p=134232#p134232

The source code for the program as a whole can be found here, but I'm not sure how trivial the task of translating the symmetry-detection code into JavaScript would be. Either way, it probably qualifies as a functional prototype.

I also have a list of patterns of various symmetries (space and time; Nakano can handle both) here for testing.

(Also, congratulations on reaching 100 pages!)
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Re: Pattern viewer for forum threads

Post by wirehead »

muzik wrote: December 28th, 2022, 4:25 pm The source code for the program as a whole can be found here, but I'm not sure how trivial the task of translating the symmetry-detection code into JavaScript would be. Either way, it probably qualifies as a functional prototype.
Functional, yes, and Python is very easy to port to Javascript if you rely on libraries like Lodash/Underscore to fill in the gaps. However, this implementation has a few critical holes: it relies on NumPy for matrix math and Lifelib for... well, things Lifeviewer can do (computing the period of a pattern, reflecting and rotation cells, etc), but again, are impossible for a programmer who is not Chris Rowett to utilize.
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Re: Pattern viewer for forum threads

Post by rowett »

muzik wrote: December 24th, 2022, 10:52 am This either doesn't generate a period map at all or generates a tiny one
I reproduced this on my iPhone. Should be fixed now.
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Re: Pattern viewer for forum threads

Post by rowett »

muzik wrote: December 23rd, 2022, 5:29 pm Also, would it be possible to make the counts for each cell period accessible via the Identify results table rather than only having them in Help > Info? They could be included alongside the key like in the original Oscillizer, or included separately via a third button on the right of the table.
This is now implemented.
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Re: Pattern viewer for forum threads

Post by muzik »

rowett wrote: October 14th, 2022, 1:03 am
muzik wrote: October 11th, 2022, 3:44 am Would it be possible to have the T button remain present in VIEWONLY patterns?
Yes, done.
Can the same also be done for error patterns?:

Code: Select all

#CXRLE Gen=-250
x = 10, y = 10, rule = B3/S23:T10000,10000
2o2b2obobo$o2bo3bo$b3o2bobo$o4bo$2bo2b3obo$4bobo2bo$7ob2o$bo5b2o$5b4o$
2o4bobo!
[[ SHOWGENSTATS  ]]

Code: Select all

#CXRLE Gen=-250
x = 10, y = 10, rule = B3/S23
2o2b2obobo$o2bo3bo$b3o2bobo$o4bo$2bo2b3obo$4bobo2bo$7ob2o$bo5b2o$5b10000o$
2o4bobo!
[[ SHOWGENSTATS ]]

Code: Select all

#CXRLE Gen=-250
x = 10, y = 10, rule = B3/S23History
GA2.2A.A.A$A2.A3.A$.3A2.A.A$A4.A$2.A2.3A.A$4.A.A2.A$7A.2A$.A5.2A$5.4A
$2A4.A.A!
[[ SHOWGENSTATS ]]
In the second example above, the generation is set to 0 for some reason despite it being defined as -250, and no rule is shown either (but mousing over where the rule should be reveals an empty line, followed by "Moore"). Nothing gets shown for moused-over states either.

In the following pattern, going to Help > Info > Theme named the "Error" color "Select" for some reason. After having opened the second pattern I can't reproduce this anymore, but a * is now shown after "Error" for some reason (this seems to affect normal patterns as well and therefore might be intentional):

Code: Select all

#CXRLE Gen=-250
x = 10, y = 10, rule = B3/S23:T10000,10000
2o2b2obobo$o2bo3bo$b3o2bobo$o4bo$2bo2b3obo$4bobo2bo$7ob2o$bo5b2o$5b4o$
2o4bobo!
[[ SHOWGENSTATS COLOR ERROR Lime ]]

Code: Select all

#CXRLE Gen=-250
x = 10, y = 10, rule = B3/S23:T10000,10000
2o2b2obobo$o2bo3bo$b3o2bobo$o4bo$2bo2b3obo$4bobo2bo$7ob2o$bo5b2o$5b4o$
2o4bobo!
[[ SHOWGENSTATS COLOR ERROR Green ]]
Let me know if you can reproduce the bug, since I didn't bother to screenshot it at the time.
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Re: Pattern viewer for forum threads

Post by rowett »

muzik wrote: January 1st, 2023, 7:57 pm Can the same also be done for error patterns?
No because then some longer error message will be clipped and it's more important to see the error than the T button.
muzik wrote: January 1st, 2023, 7:57 pm In the second example above, the generation is set to 0 for some reason despite it being defined as -250, and no rule is shown either (but mousing over where the rule should be reveals an empty line, followed by "Moore"). Nothing gets shown for moused-over states either.
This is fixed in the next build.
muzik wrote: January 1st, 2023, 7:57 pm In the following pattern, going to Help > Info > Theme named the "Error" color "Select" for some reason. After having opened the second pattern I can't reproduce this anymore, but a * is now shown after "Error" for some reason (this seems to affect normal patterns as well and therefore might be intentional)
I can't reproduce it either. The Select colour is the same as the Error colour so perhaps you looked at the wrong line.
The * is intentional.
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Re: Pattern viewer for forum threads

Post by rowett »

I've improved the layout and style of the Identify Oscillator Strict Volatility results to make them fit better with the rest of LifeViewer.
The cell period table needs to have paging or scrolling so that's to come.

Code: Select all

x = 44, y = 1, rule = MAPAAD//zAwPz8AAP//MDA/PwAA//8AAP//AAD//wAA//8AAD8/AAD//wAAPz8AAP//wMD//wAA///AwP//AAD//w
44o!
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Re: Pattern viewer for forum threads

Post by muzik »

For patterns with two periods, I find that the two dark colors used don't contrast against the background well enough.

Code: Select all

x = 15, y = 16, rule = B3/S23
o11bo$3o7b3o$3bo5bo$2b2o5b2o2$6b2o$6b2o$6bobo$7b2o$7b2o2$4b2o5b2o$5bo5bo$2b3o
7b3o$bo12bo$b2o!
Could the period map background be made theme-dependent so that the currently used theme can be changed to alleviate this issue?
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Re: Pattern viewer for forum threads

Post by rowett »

muzik wrote: January 4th, 2023, 8:35 pm For patterns with two periods, I find that the two dark colors used don't contrast against the background well enough.

Code: Select all

x = 15, y = 16, rule = B3/S23
o11bo$3o7b3o$3bo5bo$2b2o5b2o2$6b2o$6b2o$6bobo$7b2o$7b2o2$4b2o5b2o$5bo5bo$2b3o
7b3o$bo12bo$b2o!
I've improved the contrast of the dark colours.
muzik wrote: January 4th, 2023, 8:35 pm Could the period map background be made theme-dependent so that the currently used theme can be changed to alleviate this issue?
No.
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Re: Pattern viewer for forum threads

Post by muzik »

Is it intended that rule names which span two lines do not permit a third line break to separate the neighbourhood type (and alias if it exists) in the T menu when moused over?

Code: Select all

x = 1, y = 1, rule = R3,C2,S1,3,5,7,9,11,13,15,17,19,21,23, B1,3,5,7,9,11,13,15,17,19,21,23,NN
o!
[[ SHOWGENSTATS ]]
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Re: Pattern viewer for forum threads

Post by rowett »

muzik wrote: January 5th, 2023, 10:05 pm Is it intended that rule names which span two lines do not permit a third line break to separate the neighbourhood type (and alias if it exists) in the T
Yes - tool tips are limited to 2 lines.
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Re: Pattern viewer for forum threads

Post by muzik »

Is the snow effect itself handled as a cellular automaton? It behaviourally resembles the Sand Margolus rule, although some non-determinism seems to be present to some extent (some particles collapse spontaneously, and some fall faster than others).
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Re: Pattern viewer for forum threads

Post by rowett »

muzik wrote: January 9th, 2023, 1:15 pm Is the snow effect itself handled as a cellular automaton? It behaviourally resembles the Sand Margolus rule, although some non-determinism seems to be present to some extent (some particles collapse spontaneously, and some fall faster than others).
No, it's not. It's a simple particle simulation. Non-determinism is used for the falling speed, and the chance of a stacked snowflake falling left or right if possible.

It is loosely based on code I wrote for Golly's overlay demo: The "Drawing Pixels" feature in Scripts/Lua/overlay-demo.lua. The source code for which is here. See the function test_set() for more info.
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Re: Pattern viewer for forum threads

Post by muzik »

What do the asterisks next to Text, Error and Help in Help > Info > Theme indicate?

Code: Select all

x = 9, y = 5, rule = B3/S23
$bo3b3o$b3o2bo$2bo!
[[ COLOR HELP Salmon COLOR TEXT Pink COLOR ERROR PaleGreen COLOR SELECT SpringGreen ZOOM 0 ]]
For period maps, could some way to see the RGB/hexadecimal color values used for each period me added somewhere, perhaps in a help section either under themes/UI/etc. or in Help's Identify results, or when mousing over each cell period's color square in the Identify period counts table?

I'd also like period maps to be created for identified Margolus patterns, since these are several patterns with behaviour that this would assist in analysis with.
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Re: Pattern viewer for forum threads

Post by muzik »

Unless there's something I'm not seeing, Identify should give a mod of 2 for this spaceship, not 4:

Code: Select all

x = 154, y = 332, rule = R2,C3,S30-48,B24-36,NG
100.4A$100.4A$100.A2.A$100.2A.A$100.B2AB$102.B!
Also, could period maps be enabled for Generations-type rules? It seems trivial to implement, since you only really need to pay attention to the first two states anyway if I'm thinking about this correctly.

Code: Select all

x = 4, y = 3, rule = 3458/38/6
.2AE$3AD$.BC!
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Re: Pattern viewer for forum threads

Post by rowett »

muzik wrote: January 13th, 2023, 11:14 am What do the asterisks next to Text, Error and Help in Help > Info > Theme indicate?
That they were customised.
muzik wrote: January 13th, 2023, 11:14 am For period maps, could some way to see the RGB/hexadecimal color values used for each period me added somewhere, perhaps in a help section either under themes/UI/etc. or in Help's Identify results, or when mousing over each cell period's color square in the Identify period counts table?
Yes, it's now in Help->Info->Identify.
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Re: Pattern viewer for forum threads

Post by rowett »

muzik wrote: January 13th, 2023, 11:52 am Unless there's something I'm not seeing, Identify should give a mod of 2 for this spaceship, not 4:
Fixed, thanks!
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Re: Pattern viewer for forum threads

Post by muzik »

Could the color value of the map's background also be displayed there, since it's another type of cell just like the periodic cells? (Either that, or it, as well as maybe the grid, could be made customizable, since they remain constant regardless of the oscillator being identified.)

Another thing: ever since the period map functionality was implemented, LifeViewer has been able to produce all of the information about a pattern that Oscillizer was able to, except for the minimum and maximum rule that a given pattern works in. Would it be possible to add this for range-1 outer-totalistic rules? Catagolue does this on object pages already - I believe this is the code responsible, which also handles isotropic non-totalistic rules.

----

Since we've been testing the map feature regularly since it was first implemented a month ago, an idea sprang to mind recently: it's entirely likely that for high-period oscillators, the period itself will be known, but other aspects of its behaviour that Identify can output will not be. Filling in information on the wiki, checking out crazy high period oscillators on Catagolue, and generally testing out Identify and its behaviour are three situations I've found myself in. Would it be possible to implement into LifeViewer a way to input an expected period for a given oscillator or spaceship, such that LifeViewer doesn't first need to take the time to check the pattern for periodicity?

For example, here's the p46-based pRNG oscillator. We already know it has a period of 40894, but LifeViewer doesn't. So it has to run this pattern until it goes a bit over that value, which, given the fact it's a rather large pattern in terms of bounding box, takes 23 whole seconds:

Code: Select all

x = 156, y = 75, rule = B3/S23
146b2o5b2o$146b2o5b2o16$145b2obo3bob2o$145bo2bo3bo2bo$146b3o3b3o3$31b
2o$33bo$18b2o10b2o2bo$18b2o11bo2bo$32bobo$32b2o119b2o$153b2o$32b2o$32b
obo$18b2o11bo2bo10b2o30b2o$18b2o10b2o2bo10b2o30b2o$b2o4b3o23bo$b2o3bo
3bo20b2o$6b2ob2o$7bobo67bo$53bo2bo19bobo66bo2bo$7bobo21b4o22bo17b2ob2o
69bo$6b2ob2o19bo3bo18bo3bo16bobob3o64bo3bo$6bo3bo4b2o17bo19b4o14bob2o
2b2o66b4o$7b3o4b2o14bo2bo38bobo77b2o$16bo135bobo$154bo$86b2o34bo31b2o$
69b2o15bobo7b2o24b2o$51bo3b3o11b2o17bo7b2o23bobo$36b2o12bobo2b5o26b3o$
36b2o12bo3b2o3b2o$51bo2bo3b2o$3o5b3o41b3o3bo$o2b2ob2o2bo16bo58b3o$b3o
3b3o16b2o24b3o3bo10b2o17bo7b2o$2bo5bo17bobo22bo2bo3b2o9b2o15bobo7b2o$
36b2o12bo3b2o3b2o2b2o21b2o$36b2o12bobo2b5o3b2o$51bo3b3o52b2o$111b2o$
92bo17bo$50b2o38bo2bo$b2o5b2o42bo25b2o10b5o$b2o5b2o39b2o2bo10b2o12b2o
10b3ob2o$31bo18bo2bo10b2o25b2obo15bo3bo$30bo2bo4b2o11bobo38b2o15bo5bo
9b2o$17b2o10b5o3b2o12b2o56bo15b2o$17b2o9b2ob3o5bo52b2o15b2o3bo$29bob2o
18b2o38b2obo16b3o$30b2o19bobo24b2o10b3ob2o$50bo2bo10b2o12b2o10b5o16b3o
$30b2o17b2o2bo10b2o24bo2bo15b2o3bo$29bob2o19bo39bo16bo15b2o$17b2o9b2ob
3o16b2o57bo5bo9b2o$17b2o10b5o76bo3bo$30bo2bo$31bo!
But say we had a way to immediately tell LifeViewer "this pattern right here is a period-40894 oscillator, or ancestor thereof". So all LifeViewer needs to do now is immediately skip to generation 40894, without having to keep track of any previous phases besides the starting one, the one at 40894, and perhaps the one at 81788 if 0 and 40894 don't match. Once it can confirm that yes, this pattern indeed is the period that was specified, it can immediately get to calculating all of those other statistics that we're after. (If the wrong period is specified, there's always the cancel button, though I suppose that for very high periods it'll probably reach 1048576 quite fast anyway and cancel itself automatically. It might be advisable to display the provided period next to the "Identifying..." text to allow users to notice any input mistakes if desired.)

----

Back to the small suggestions: for oscillators, if a map/periods table cannot be displayed due to the period being too high, could the buttons on the right hand side be left there, but grayed out, similarly to how N/A is displayed for strict volatility in such cases?
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Re: Pattern viewer for forum threads

Post by rowett »

muzik wrote: January 13th, 2023, 2:50 pm Could the color value of the map's background also be displayed there, since it's another type of cell just like the periodic cells? (Either that, or it, as well as maybe the grid, could be made customizable, since they remain constant regardless of the oscillator being identified.)
Yes, the background and grid colours will be there in the next build.
muzik wrote: January 13th, 2023, 2:50 pm Another thing: ever since the period map functionality was implemented, LifeViewer has been able to produce all of the information about a pattern that Oscillizer was able to, except for the minimum and maximum rule that a given pattern works in.
Unlikely, but I'll take a look.
muzik wrote: January 13th, 2023, 2:50 pm Since we've been testing the map feature regularly since it was first implemented a month ago, an idea sprang to mind recently: it's entirely likely that for high-period oscillators, the period itself will be known, but other aspects of its behaviour that Identify can output will not be. Filling in information on the wiki, checking out crazy high period oscillators on Catagolue, and generally testing out Identify and its behaviour are three situations I've found myself in. Would it be possible to implement into LifeViewer a way to input an expected period for a given oscillator or spaceship, such that LifeViewer doesn't first need to take the time to check the pattern for periodicity?
No. I don't mind waiting 20-30 seconds for the correct answer.
muzik wrote: January 13th, 2023, 2:50 pm Back to the small suggestions: for oscillators, if a map/periods table cannot be displayed due to the period being too high, could the buttons on the right hand side be left there, but grayed out, similarly to how N/A is displayed for strict volatility in such cases?
No. If the results are N/A there's no point in cluttering the display.
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Re: Pattern viewer for forum threads

Post by muzik »

Would it be possible to be able to individually show and hide the values for "Alive", "Births" and "Deaths" in the population graph?

Also, is it intended that bounded grids don't display births or deaths in the graph? I know they're omitted from the T menu, but even at that it seems strange to render them absent outright.
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Re: Pattern viewer for forum threads

Post by muzik »

Identify outputs a mod of 4 for this oscillator, which should be impossible given that its period is 124:

Code: Select all

x = 33, y = 10, rule = R2,C6,M0,S2..3,B3..3,NN
30.A.A2$30.A.A2$11.4A$11.ACEB$11.2A2E$A.A8.2AE$12.D2E$A.A!
I'm not even sure if this oscillator is time-symmetric in the first place. It certainly feels like one since part of it does reflect/rotate, but it's one of those ones that switch between creation and destruction of objects, kind of like this one, which has a highly symmetric envelope and period map but is ultimately temporally asymmetric:

Code: Select all

x = 7, y = 5, rule = B2in3aijqr4ikqz5r6n/S2aek3-ae4city5-ejqy6a7e
2bo$b3o$2obo$bobo$4bobo!
Oscillators like these are a significant potion of why I'd like to see strict volatility and period maps for Generations rules, since there are many others like it which definitely have internal lower-period mechanisms such as the central flipping portion which is responsible for the creation and destruction of the outer still lifes, and it'd help a lot to get a clearer picture of it. I just don't know how easy it would be to implement, though.

Lastly, here's another minor Identify suggestion: since an average value is calculated for a given pattern's population and heat, it must be tracking those values somehow for each generation of a given pattern. Would it be possible to make those values accessible somehow, perhaps in the form of a graph which can be accessed by a fourth button on the right of the table?

EDIT: Identify for LTL Generations just generally seems to be acting up in general. This gives different results when identifying it from T=0 and immediately after the first identification:

Code: Select all

x = 32, y = 121, rule = R2,C4,M1,S4..6,B4..5,NN
6$14.A$13.3A$14.A3$13.3A$13.ABA$13.ABA$13.3A4$13.3A$13.ABA$13.ABA$13.
3A3$14.A$13.3A$14.A6$5.C2A$6.B2A4.2A$4.CA.B5.A.A$6.B2A4.2A$5.C2A8$5.C
2A$6.B2A4.2A$4.CA.B5.A.A$6.B2A4.2A$5.C2A8$5.C2A$6.B2A4.2A$4.CA.B5.A.A
$6.B2A4.2A$5.C2A8$5.C2A$6.B2A4.2A$4.CA.B5.A.A$6.B2A4.2A$5.C2A8$5.C2A$
6.B2A4.2A$4.CA.B5.A.A$6.B2A4.2A$5.C2A6$14.A$13.3A$14.A3$13.3A$13.ABA$
13.ABA$13.3A4$13.3A$13.ABA$13.ABA$13.3A3$14.A$13.3A$14.A!
And this displays a mod identical to its period, along with a symmetry transform, which seems a tad unusual until you notice that this oscillator is actually identified as a spaceship:

Code: Select all

x = 8, y = 5, rule = R2,C3,S2-3,7,B4,8,N*
2.2A$.A2.A$2A.3A$.A2.A$2.2A!
And this oscillator gets marked as a still life:

Code: Select all

x = 10, y = 6, rule = R2,C5,S2-3,B3,8,NB
.A6.A$.2AC2.C2A$B2D.2A.2DB$B2D.2A.2DB$.2AC2.C2A$.A6.A!
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rowett
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Re: Pattern viewer for forum threads

Post by rowett »

muzik wrote: January 14th, 2023, 10:52 am Identify outputs a mod of 4 for this oscillator, which should be impossible given that its period is 124

Identify for LTL Generations just generally seems to be acting up in general. This gives different results when identifying it from T=0 and immediately after the first identification

And this displays a mod identical to its period, along with a symmetry transform, which seems a tad unusual until you notice that this oscillator is actually identified as a spaceship

And this oscillator gets marked as a still life
These should all be fixed now.
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muzik
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Re: Pattern viewer for forum threads

Post by muzik »

I've noticed that a few higher-range patterns have been interacting oddly with bounded grids, causing cells to be visibly born outside of the boundary.

Code: Select all

x = 2, y = 2, rule = R5,C0,S21-28,B1-7,N@0E06310120280300C01404808C6070:T100,100
2o$2o!

Code: Select all

x = 16, y = 16, rule = R3,C4,S6-10,B4,13,N2:T16
2$.A2.B.B2.A2.B.B$A2.B.2C.A2.B.2C$2.A.2C.B2.A.2C.B$.A2.B.B2.A2.B.B5$.
A2.B.B2.A2.B.B$A2.B.2C.A2.B.2C$2.A.2C.B2.A.2C.B$.A2.B.B2.A2.B.B!
It's possible to interact with these to some extent via Select All and flipping, but otherwise not much can be done with this. Using Select All on the second pattern also seems bugged, since not all cells are selected. Manually selecting the whole bounded grid and then filling randomly appears to leave rows blank the clear button leaves those rows untouched, flipping does not work correctly, rotation is forbidden for not fitting in the grid even though it would and nudging selections downwards is forbidden when two cells above the bottom boundary.

Also, it looks like this thread just hit 2500 total posts, concluding the hundredth page...
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